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  #61  
Old 7th November 2015, 21:55
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Originally Posted by EmilyPost View Post
Most artists follow a Bell Curve when it comes to artistic creativity and there is no crime in that.
Indeed and I totally agree. But some people (including you sometimes) use it to be critical calling him a hasbeen etc etc.

I'm just pointing out that we are all (or should be) on the same side i.e. in George's corner...
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  #62  
Old 7th November 2015, 22:12
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Indeed and I totally agree. But some people (including you sometimes) use it to be critical calling him a hasbeen etc etc.

I'm just pointing out that we are all (or should be) on the same side i.e. in George's corner...
You do understand that this is a discussion forum,right? People post their opinions even if they are critical of George. Then, other people post replies that either challenge or support the original post. It is alot more interesting than everybody cheering George on no matter what he does or doesn't do.
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  #63  
Old 7th November 2015, 22:16
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Originally Posted by HSL View Post
Mr B.I.G. another wild assumption.

Would you care to expand on this please ?

And please don't give me all that crap about drug use etc......

You serious? Depression, a hedonistic lifestyle, excessive drug usage . . . you think there's no underlying drivers behind such behaviour over the last 2 decades +?
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  #64  
Old 7th November 2015, 22:19
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Originally Posted by HSL View Post
Indeed and I totally agree. But some people (including you sometimes) use it to be critical calling him a hasbeen etc etc.

I'm just pointing out that we are all (or should be) on the same side i.e. in George's corner...
We're all George fans - some of us however like to operate with the blinkers off

Last edited by Notorious; 7th November 2015 at 22:30..
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  #65  
Old 7th November 2015, 23:31
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Originally Posted by EmilyPost View Post
You do understand that this is a discussion forum,right? People post their opinions even if they are critical of George. Then, other people post replies that either challenge or support the original post. It is alot more interesting than everybody cheering George on no matter what he does or doesn't do.
Maybe there is a Bell Curve for forums as well. With all the due respect some very negative and unpleasant attitudes flowing here have turned this place into a desert (in terms of statistic relevance) but if you're satisfied to 'moderate' a couple of dozens of people when an average group of GM's fans on Facebook (or GM's topics on Twitter) count thousand active people per day (and there is plenty of it around) I'm just happy for you. Have a nice evening
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  #66  
Old 7th November 2015, 23:56
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Maybe there is a Bell Curve for forums as well. With all the due respect some very negative and unpleasant attitudes flowing here have turned this place into a desert (in terms of statistic relevance) but if you're satisfied to 'moderate' a couple of dozens of people when an average group of GM's fans on Facebook (or GM's topics on Twitter) count thousand active people per day (and there is plenty of it around) I'm just happy for you. Have a nice evening
If you prefer the kind of silly adoration found on Facebook and Twitter then by all means go for it.

No one is forcing you to visit here.

Last edited by EmilyPost; 8th November 2015 at 00:06..
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  #67  
Old 8th November 2015, 02:36
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Originally Posted by EmilyPost View Post
If you prefer the kind of silly adoration found on Facebook and Twitter then by all means go for it.

No one is forcing you to visit here.
I'm all for honest debate...but there are those of us who have a positive GM bias (i'm in that camp) and those who have a deliberate GM negative bias - almost a deliberate desire to show the negative side of George. It's almost like there is a "need" to sanitise the adoration shown on other social media - which i agree can be excessive.

Personally i don't see the need for either on this forum. People here aren't advocating the twitter or Facebook adoration. It's a more sensible (and often quite intellectual) debate forum. We should just be honest rather than try to"balance" anything. Some are harsher than others on George and that's fine...but lets just say what we personally think rather than say what we think we should say to balance out those that can't see the wood for the trees.

I'm not ashamed to say i love George and do see the best in him where i can - but i'm not an idiot...i see the bad stuff and there are bits i don't like...but ultimately this is a GM forum where one would expect the many comments to be mainly positive - but i see most comments being negative (and that's not normal on a fan site). I find that sad, i really do. I want to hear good things about him rather than bad things (peppered with constructive criticism perhaps where required). He is flawed but ultimately he's a great artist IMHO. It's fine to constructively criticise but if all i hear is bad things i'm not sure i want to hear it constantly as it's quite depressing.

Can't we try to be a little more positive for a man we all ultimately respect as a major talent...rather that constantly slag him down for his shortcomings as a man.

Just my opinion.
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  #68  
Old 8th November 2015, 03:19
Onef*ckfantasy Onef*ckfantasy est déconnecté
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I do present the 'other side' of the argument when I read too much over the top or rose-tinted praise for a man who has frankly tested all or most of our patience over the years. But I am not untruthful - I do genuinely feel the things that I write here and I would much rather read a light and shade forum than the stuff on GM's Twitter and Facebook pages, which I can only imagine makes him cringe too.

I am unsure where I stand regarding GM at the moment. I maintain an interest in him, clearly, otherwise I wouldn't come here - I am interested to know what if anything comes next and whether he can pull things back together. But in his absence, particularly this past year, I have sought out a lot of other music - there's so much other stuff to discover - and that's made me question whether I fit with his music any more; perhaps my tastes have changed. I rarely listen to him now, maybe I am tired of hearing the same songs over and over.

I am frustrated with him for being so negligent with his talent and not exploring it and developing as much as he might have done over his career, particularly recently. To have a voice like his and put cigarette after cigarette into his mouth, particularly after having pneumonia, seems madness to me. So I find it hard to admire him now. There's been a lot to dislike. But I also accept that his music was a massive part of my growing up - I loved it more than any other. I have followed the progress of his life good and bad so I can't quite walk away altogether either. I will always be interested to know what happens to him, rather like a long lost friend that I no longer see around.
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  #69  
Old 8th November 2015, 03:42
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Thanks for that..and i like that honesty...nothing wrong with it.I'm not criticising you at all. You see a need to state the other side which is fine and that's healthy and sparks good debate. I hear your frustration. I just find it odd that on a forum this size there are more negative than positive comments generally.

My sadness lies really in the fact people have moved into twitter and Facebook with one line non comments rather than proper debate as on here. If they hadn't then maybe the forum would be more as you'd expect of a fan site. i.e. a more grown up version of a Facebook page.

I don't know. I just feel the need to defend George much more on here than on other sites....which can be tiring in the same way those who despair with the "isn't he marvellous regardless" find it tiresome too.

Anyway, off to bed now. Sleep well all.

Last edited by Parklife; 8th November 2015 at 11:07..
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  #70  
Old 8th November 2015, 11:50
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We all love George on this forum. That's the test for me if you should be on this forum. Not if you decide to try and understand the lack of musical output and personal issues from being blunt or indeed overly positive.
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  #71  
Old 8th November 2015, 13:01
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Originally Posted by Parklife View Post
but there are those of us who have a positive GM bias (i'm in that camp) and those who have a deliberate GM negative bias - almost a deliberate desire to show the negative side of George.
Very true and the 3rd aspect is being unbais which would be difficult for hardcore fans.

Obviously George is not perfect just like the rest of us but contant negativity does get draining after a while. I find myself defending him all the time. Thats probably why he closed the forum on his own website. I mean, he's probably thinking these guys are meant to be on my side !

As a hardcore fan of course my views and opinions will be blinkered. Its a bit like being a parent - you seldom like to think of the negatives in your own kids and will defend them in public even though you know they are in the wrong. George is the same (well for me it is).

As an example take Michael Jackson - now that guy had issues which makes George look like a saint yet (because I am a fan) I will always discuss the good stuff and not the BS about the negative stuff.

Another example, every Saturday Premier League managers (Yanks this is Soccer Managers) will publically defend there own players when its clear to see they were wrong. Why ?
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  #72  
Old 8th November 2015, 19:45
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As a relatively new GM fan, I was initially surprised by often overall negative tones on this forum. It can be a bit unpleasant from time to time. On the other hand, I did enjoy some discussions about GM’s music, which is the main reason I decided to join the forum. I have also learned to ignore some negative comments, but often can’t help but defend George.


Although I could probably never really understand the frustration (by some) related to being GM’s fan for 30 years, I can guess where those negative comments are from. It is almost like marrying (mentally) to someone for 30 years. Although you saw some accumulated flaws of your partner, it is hard not to continue to care for that person who has provided you inspiration and pleasant memories. So for some, it may be a love and hate relationship to GM. Or alternatively, like HSL, you kind of view GM as a close brother or even a child. Hey, George can drive some of his fans nuts in different ways.


Unlike some of you, George is not the first musician I have admired (the Beatles and MJ as well as a couple of others came before GM). But George has become my favorite singer and songwriter. I admire his perfectionism, superb talent and fabulous vocal, and therefore have chosen to focus on the positive side of him, which is also the most important part of him, his music. Knowing a bit of other musicians also helps me see things in different perspectives. George has not done anything bad to anyone else except to himself. So for me, defending GM is very easy.
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  #73  
Old 8th November 2015, 19:49
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oops, sorry for double posting.
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  #74  
Old 8th November 2015, 22:38
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Or alternatively, like HSL, you kind of view GM as a close brother or even a child.
Very close older brother from another mother whom I've never met or ever likely to
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  #75  
Old 9th November 2015, 04:53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by qp65 View Post
As a relatively new GM fan, I was initially surprised by often overall negative tones on this forum. It can be a bit unpleasant from time to time. On the other hand, I did enjoy some discussions about GM’s music, which is the main reason I decided to join the forum. I have also learned to ignore some negative comments, but often can’t help but defend George.


Although I could probably never really understand the frustration (by some) related to being GM’s fan for 30 years, I can guess where those negative comments are from. It is almost like marrying (mentally) to someone for 30 years. Although you saw some accumulated flaws of your partner, it is hard not to continue to care for that person who has provided you inspiration and pleasant memories. So for some, it may be a love and hate relationship to GM. Or alternatively, like HSL, you kind of view GM as a close brother or even a child. Hey, George can drive some of his fans nuts in different ways.


Unlike some of you, George is not the first musician I have admired (the Beatles and MJ as well as a couple of others came before GM). But George has become my favorite singer and songwriter. I admire his perfectionism, superb talent and fabulous vocal, and therefore have chosen to focus on the positive side of him, which is also the most important part of him, his music. Knowing a bit of other musicians also helps me see things in different perspectives. George has not done anything bad to anyone else except to himself. So for me, defending GM is very easy.
I think you’ll find the majority on this forum would be in their late 30s/40s, somewhat past those starry eyed teenage years when their idol could do no wrong, but now capable of having well balanced unbiased discussions, with full respect for the artist in question. That’s completely different from not being a George fan.

Last edited by Notorious; 9th November 2015 at 12:17..
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